Catholic Online Forum

Wow.

http://canonlawblog.blogspot.com/2011/0 ... vones.html



Just...wow.

Nuttiness is right, Mr. Peters.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

Dean, you need to stay. I highly value your input here and I think many others also do.

As for "rock star', I think sometimes we need strong words to to help us focus on the possible threats to the unity of the Body of Christ.


Perhaps all the comments on "rock star' should be shipped off to the Off-Topic Thread.


Mary

_________________
"Those who encounter the Risen Jesus
and entrust themselves docilely to him have nothing to fear.
This is the message that Christians are called to spread
to the very ends of the earth." Benedict XVI

Everyone.

I don't know if Dean will continue with this conversation or not. Now is a little bit late, after some silly comments about his use of the term "rock star priest" to be begging him to stay. He has every right to be very unamused.

So if you have something important and useful to contribute to the Fr. Pavone discussion, please fire away. If you have some need to dwell on the rock star terminology, then please go and start another thread somewhere else and leave Dean and other very thought provoking people to contribute the valuable and insightful comments they are known for.

As for me, I like the term rock star priest. In fact, I will now start using it, because it is an extremely apt, appropriate, and reality capturing metaphor. It has nothing to do with the intentions of the rock star priest. It does not at all infer that the rock star priest is a bad person.

And it certainly doesn't mean that the rock star priest is like Mick Jagger, Lady Gaga, can play the electric guitar, or even wear funny make-up and costumes. The rock star priest is simply a famous person. The fame doesn't come attached to a stage or antics. It comes attached to some media that has made them well known and susceptible to the varied and many temptations of well known people.

Rock star priests exists all over the place, for heaven's sake. They are part of the new reality of lights, camera, action. Even when we priests never step in front of a camera, we can become little rock stars in our own parish. In the country towns of the rural dioceses, and that means ME included, the priest cannot go anywhere and not be noticed and given homage of one kind or another.

I think this homage is nice, but at the same time it bothers me. It is easy, VERY EASY, to go into my Bishop's office with a chip on my shoulder or a little attitude of my importance. And I am a country pastor. I think it is far more difficult for the priest who has even more importance attached to his name from a wider audience.

_________________
Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

Jeff:

The antics of the Center for Bio Ethical Reform against Bishop Zurek are simply going to antagonize the situation between Pavone and his bishop. I wonder if they even pondered that the Bishop will be out of the diocese for two weeks.

It almost seems like a plot from pro-aborts. Pickets and disruptions at Catholic parishes and schools will get "in the face" of those who don't have the slightest clue about the Zurek-Pavone conflict and will now be dragged into the midst of it. Instead of getting angry with the Bishop or with Father, they may just say, "this is why I am a pro-choice Catholic, and will happily stay one, because being pro-life makes you behave like a nutty."

So, instead of helping the pre-born children, the pickets will be seen as a weird provocation against Catholic parishioners and school children for not doing enough to coerce their bishop into letting Fr. Pavone do whatever he wants. I'm scratching my head. And the lesson learned? And for what good?

The instant sign of an unbalanced mind is to drag molested children and the Spanish Inquisition into the discussion between the Bishop and Father Pavone. Again, I'm scratching my head. I pray that Father Pavone soon illuminates his brighter light into this sorry attempt at intimidation of the Bishop. If he does not, I am going to have serious and grave concerns about his intentions.

_________________
Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

Jeff, this to me is like a big warning: do not donate to PFL. "Consider withholding donations" is a polite way of saying "I think you should withhold donations." I use it that way myself when I am trying to be diplomatic about something.[/quote] I think there may also be a legal issue here. He has no authority to order anyone in another diocese to do or not do something. If he ordered those in his diocese not to contribute he would probably have to show cause in some court. I think anything stronger than what he said would be asking for lots of legal [Church and possibly civil] trouble.

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- Joe Kelley

Death is only a shadow across the path to Heaven.

It is very possible that after the Corapi situation every bishop is looking closely at priests who are on their own, and very well known, so as to make sure we don't have another Corapi situation. Personally I think it would be stupid of the bishops not to take a close look at every priest who is in the limelight. The best thing that Fr. Pavone can do right now is obey. So far he has. He immediately returned to Texas. I believe that's a good sign.

By the way Dean, I think your rock star analogy was a good one. While Fr. Pavone does not seem the type to seek the limelight for his own ego, he does have a large fan club and he is very well known.


Effie

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“The business of Progressives is to go on making mistakes. The business of Conservatives is to prevent mistakes from being corrected.” –G.K Chesterton

Judy Brown has a good article on this today at the ALL web site - Father Pavone: A Rush to Judgment

She concludes:

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- Joe Kelley

Death is only a shadow across the path to Heaven.

Joe:

Thank you for sharing the words of Judy Brown. I have such deep respect for her, as I do for Father Pavone, and I am relieved that she is raising a voice of reason and spiritual discernment during this difficult time. She rightfully pointed out that secular means of protests and campaigning are not the proper methods of the Christian faithful.

Praise God that Fr. Pavone is back in Amarillo and preparing to discuss these matters with his bishop. I hope that God fills him with holy wisdom and prudence as he takes his next step, and that his bishop works with him in a way that is beneficial for the diocese and for the pro-life movement.

_________________
Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

I've been wondering about Priests (plural) for Life and what will happen to the ministry if it turns out that Fr. Pavone is removed from there. I don't really know much about them, but from looking at the web site, I only see one other priest. Rachel's Vineyard seems to have no other priest. Is Priests for Life basically Fr Pavone and (it looks like) a lot of lay people? What do you think will happen to that ministry if he is not allowed to run it?

_________________
Grace

As to the past, let us entrust it to God's mercy, the future to Divine Providence. Our task is to live holy the present moment. - Saint Gianna Molla

"So if you have something important and useful to contribute to the Fr. Pavone discussion, please fire away. If you have some need to dwell on the rock star terminology, then please go and start another thread somewhere else and leave Dean and other very thought provoking people to contribute the valuable and insightful comments they are known for."

I didn't know we had a volunteer "Poster Police" squad.
Hey sign me up for that too. Do I get a badge?

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Pax et Bonum


Schultzz

Effie, I think there is a great deal of wisdom here. I know that if I were a bishop (God forbid), the Corapi situation would prompt me to take steps to ensure that the priests in my care are following their primary vocation (to the priesthood) properly, lest another false prophet lead my flock astray, as Corapi may be doing even now. I would not be surprised in the least if that was the catalyst for Bishop Zurek's actions in this case.

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Jeff Stevens

LOL. Schultzz, I'd like to sign you up, but then I'm afraid it would go to your head and you would act like a "rock star."

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Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

Great comeback Father!

_________________
Pax et Bonum


Schultzz

Thank you Schultzz. Now, as Poster Police, I must ask you to contribute something important and useful to the Fr. Pavone discussion. In lieu of something important and useful, you can just say what is really on your mind. LOL. (sorry, I haven't had my coffee, and I am being silly).

_________________
Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

...you guys are good!!!


Mary

_________________
"Those who encounter the Risen Jesus
and entrust themselves docilely to him have nothing to fear.
This is the message that Christians are called to spread
to the very ends of the earth." Benedict XVI

So is Fr. Barron next? He certainly fits the above description of a "Rock Star" priest.

_________________
BobA

JMJ

Link to summary of posts by Ed Peters on this story:

http://canonlawblog.blogspot.com/2011/0 ... avone.html

_________________
FabrizioParty like it's 1773

No one can be at the same time a good Catholic and a true socialist (Pius XI)

JMJ

UPDATE:

Public Statement Concerning Rev. Frank A. Pavone by Bishop Patrick J. Zurek, June 20, 2012

In its decree of May 18, 2012, the Congregation for the Clergy has sustained Father Frank A. Pavone’s appeal of his suspension from ministry outside the Diocese of Amarillo and his appointment from me on October 4, 2011 as Chaplain of the Disciples of the Lord Jesus Christ in Channing, Texas. Father Pavone is to continue his ministry as chaplain until further notice. As a gesture of good will, I will grant permission to him in individual cases, based upon their merits, to participate in pro-life events with the provision that he and I must be in agreement beforehand as to his role and function.

All other matters are outside the purview of this statement.

Amarillo, Texas, June 20, 2012

+Most Rev. Patrick J. Zurek, STL, DD
Bishop of Amarillo

Statement by Priests For Life: http://www.priestsforlife.org/columns/4 ... nes-appeal

We are happy to announce that the Vatican has upheld Father Frank Pavone's appeal and has declared that Father Pavone is not now nor has ever been suspended. Father Pavone remains a priest in good standing all over the world.

We were confident all along that a just decision would be made by the Vatican's Congregation for the Clergy. While we fully agree that Bishop Zurek has rightful authority over the priests of his diocese, we also see the urgent need for Father Pavone to be allowed to conduct his priestly ministry outside the diocese of Amarillo for the good of the pro-life movement.

With regard to all inquiries relative to Father Pavone's status and the Diocese of Amarillo, we will continue to be as transparent as possible and place all communications and press releases on our public website. In this way we can best respect the rights and privacy of all concerned, particularly ecclesiastical authority and communications which are intended to be confidential at this time.

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FabrizioParty like it's 1773

No one can be at the same time a good Catholic and a true socialist (Pius XI)

I really wonder why this Bishop didn't just tranfer Fr Pavone.

Glad Father won. He is doing God's work.

_________________
-Lou (Louis)

ORA et LABORA
Totus Tuus
Cacciatore/Fungaiolo

Mark Shea reflects my thoughts on the matter:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/markshea/2 ... using.html



Can anyone explain this situation to me?

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Jeff Stevens

His Bishop seems to be working very hard to rein him in, and get him back in the Diocese. Why? Your guess is as good as anyone's.

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Bob C

I know what the bishop is trying to do.

I'm trying to figure out what is Father Pavone allowed to do now? What was the impact of the Vatican statement? What WAS the Vatican's ruling exactly? Is Father Pavone complying with his bishop's restrictions?

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Jeff Stevens

I'm not sure I understand it, either. Is the Vatican's statement meant to clarify the use of the word "suspended?"

What I'm getting is that Fr. Pavone was "suspended" from working with Priests For Life, but never suspended as a priest?

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Rose West
"May God help us not to spoil His work" (Bl. Mother Theresa)

Fr. Pavone: Yay! I get to leave the diocese of Amarillo and attend pro-life functions, even though the bishop tried to restrict me to staying put within the diocese.

Bishop Zurek: Yeah, I shouldn't have forbidden you to go outside of the diocese--my bad--but when you do leave, it will be after consulting with me first and not just flying the coop when you get a wild hair. You are, after all, assigned as Chaplain to the sisters, and that means work.

That's pretty much what's going on.

_________________
Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

Thanks for the explanation Father

_________________
-Lou (Louis)

ORA et LABORA
Totus Tuus
Cacciatore/Fungaiolo