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 Post subject: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 11:34 
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Rebecca has already posted this in the prayer section but I wanted to add some comments:

‘Death panels’: Canadian court rules baby’s life support removed against parents’ wishes
Quote:
One-year-old Joseph Maraachli of Windsor, Ontario will have his life support removed Monday at 10 am. after the Ontario Superior Court today rejected an appeal by the parents to bring him home where he can die under their care….
Moe and his wife Sana have asked doctors to perform a tracheotomy so that they could take Joseph home, but the doctors refused, saying the procedure was too risky.
The Maraachlis’ daughter died from similar complications eight years ago, but in that case doctors performed a tracheotomy and she was able to die at home. Joseph’s parents want the same for him…..
What risk?
That he will die without Doctor Herod getting a fee for killing another baby boy?
How can there be risk when the court has ruled that he is already dead?
:roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 11:41 
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Joe,

That was my first thought as well. Orwellian speak.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 12:26 
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I was wondering if the doctors don't want to do the tracheotomy because it's not worth the expense (they think) since it will not save the life anyway?

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 12:40 
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For all those folks who wish for the US to have a Canadian type medical system.....be careful what you wish for.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 15:19 
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gabriel wrote:
Rebecca has already posted this in the prayer section but I wanted to add some comments:

‘Death panels’: Canadian court rules baby’s life support removed against parents’ wishes
Quote:
One-year-old Joseph Maraachli of Windsor, Ontario will have his life support removed Monday at 10 am. after the Ontario Superior Court today rejected an appeal by the parents to bring him home where he can die under their care….
Moe and his wife Sana have asked doctors to perform a tracheotomy so that they could take Joseph home, but the doctors refused, saying the procedure was too risky.
The Maraachlis’ daughter died from similar complications eight years ago, but in that case doctors performed a tracheotomy and she was able to die at home. Joseph’s parents want the same for him…..
What risk?
That he will die without Doctor Herod getting a fee for killing another baby boy?
How can there be risk when the court has ruled that he is already dead?
:roll:


So is the court afraid that the kid might not die quick enough if they let him go home? Are they afraid that with a tracheotomy the child might go on living and thus cost the government run health care program more money?

What about allowing a terminal person to die at home with some dignity?

Anyone who eagerly awaits government run health care in the USA--the bean counters' job is to spend as little per person as possible so as to avoid bankrupting the health care program thus rationing and death panels are going to be the norm.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 15:30 
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BobC wrote:
For all those folks who wish for the US to have a Canadian type medical system.....be careful what you wish for.


It's a great system, as long as you're relatively healthy.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 15:38 
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Bear wrote:
BobC wrote:
For all those folks who wish for the US to have a Canadian type medical system.....be careful what you wish for.

It's a great system, as long as you're relatively healthy.

And live in a decent sized city, where they have the capacity.

The US has a great system, too...as long as you can afford it.

Pick your poison.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 15:45 
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gabriel wrote:
Rebecca has already posted this in the prayer section but I wanted to add some comments:

‘Death panels’: Canadian court rules baby’s life support removed against parents’ wishes
Quote:
One-year-old Joseph Maraachli of Windsor, Ontario will have his life support removed Monday at 10 am. after the Ontario Superior Court today rejected an appeal by the parents to bring him home where he can die under their care….
Moe and his wife Sana have asked doctors to perform a tracheotomy so that they could take Joseph home, but the doctors refused, saying the procedure was too risky.
The Maraachlis’ daughter died from similar complications eight years ago, but in that case doctors performed a tracheotomy and she was able to die at home. Joseph’s parents want the same for him…..
What risk?
That he will die without Doctor Herod getting a fee for killing another baby boy?
How can there be risk when the court has ruled that he is already dead?
:roll:



I would agree. The primary outrage is that the parents have no rights to decide the fate of their child as evidenced by them losing their fight to stop doctors from removing the breathing tube in the first place. The secondary outrage is this one where the state not only removes the breathing tube but as well wishes to guarantee death by suffocation will happen.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 15:47 
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Kardinal wrote:
Bear wrote:
BobC wrote:
For all those folks who wish for the US to have a Canadian type medical system.....be careful what you wish for.

It's a great system, as long as you're relatively healthy.

And live in a decent sized city, where they have the capacity.

The US has a great system, too...as long as you can afford it.

Pick your poison.


With this you actually equivocate your poison...

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 16:29 
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It's a risky procedure in that if the child dies on the operating table, that goes into the doctor's and hospital's column of "adverse events."

Somewhere there's a bean counter keeping track of success rates and that sort of thing. It's possible that the doctor will get dinged for having a patient die in one way but not in another.

Not that I agree with the doctor; I think he should fight the system when it's so obviously in the wrong, but I suspect I know what's driving his decisions.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 18 Feb 2011 22:27 
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dlm wrote:
The secondary outrage is this one where the state not only removes the breathing tube but as well wishes to guarantee death by suffocation will happen.

Oh. That is cruel. We don't even kill convicted murderers that way. :(

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 19 Feb 2011 11:29 
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Arwen wrote:
dlm wrote:
The secondary outrage is this one where the state not only removes the breathing tube but as well wishes to guarantee death by suffocation will happen.

Oh. That is cruel. We don't even kill convicted murderers that way. :(


Inhumanity seems to go hand in hand with socialized health care.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2011 11:29 
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Arwen wrote:
dlm wrote:
The secondary outrage is this one where the state not only removes the breathing tube but as well wishes to guarantee death by suffocation will happen.

Oh. That is cruel. We don't even kill convicted murderers that way. :(
Apparently they intend to kill him with an injection, or have at least offered too.
Quote:
“I asked them: why not send him to Windsor and let him die at home?” he continued. “They said they will give him injection, but I don’t want to.”
I wonder what they use for the injection. They can inject a baby but have the death penalty on hold for lack of a supply of the approved drug. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2011 11:35 
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Quote:
They can inject a baby but have the death penalty on hold for lack of a supply of the approved drug. :roll:


Does Canada impose the death penalty? For criminals I mean.....we know they do for children.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2011 12:10 
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How would the child die if he were permitted to go home with the parents?

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2011 18:58 
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Posted this in the prayer thread too. . .some good news in this situation:

Baby Joseph saved from life support removal – transfer to Michigan hospital likely
http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/baby-j ... hospital-l

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2011 20:03 
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Kardinal wrote:
How would the child die if he were permitted to go home with the parents?


According to the article, they expect him to die either way, but with the tracheotomy he would be able to go home and would not have that choking thing torturing him. The parents have been through this before with a previous child and were allowed to have the tracheotomy, so they seem to know what they're asking for and how to care for the child at home.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 20 Feb 2011 20:51 
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Rose West wrote:
Kardinal wrote:
How would the child die if he were permitted to go home with the parents?


According to the article, they expect him to die either way, but with the tracheotomy he would be able to go home and would not have that choking thing torturing him. The parents have been through this before with a previous child and were allowed to have the tracheotomy, so they seem to know what they're asking for and how to care for the child at home.

Right. But HOW would the child die?

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 21 Feb 2011 14:29 
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Kardinal wrote:
Rose West wrote:
Kardinal wrote:
How would the child die if he were permitted to go home with the parents?


According to the article, they expect him to die either way, but with the tracheotomy he would be able to go home and would not have that choking thing torturing him. The parents have been through this before with a previous child and were allowed to have the tracheotomy, so they seem to know what they're asking for and how to care for the child at home.

Right. But HOW would the child die?


The child must die a certain way in a certain place at a certain time -this of man's choosing?

Assuming no miracles and the child died, the child would die 'naturally'. It is my layman understanding that long term breathing tube use usually creates swelling and can cause infection etcetera in the air passage and that this is the reason for the tracheotomy request. Otherwise, removing the tube could potentially be considered comparable to placing a pillow over the mouth of and suffocating the child.

By analogy, this situation might be comparable to that of a supposed "barren" woman; e.g. Elizabeth, who being advised by doctors that her attempts to conceive would be fruitless and since her family has a history of cervical cancer she would best be advised to undergo a radical hysterectomy. The radical hysterectomy would have prevented the world being introduced to John...

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011 13:33 
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Damn the Devil!

:)

A wee update:

BREAKING: Baby Joseph is home: defies critics by breathing completely on his own

-small excerpt:
Quote:
WINDSOR, Ontario, April 21, 2011 (LifeSiteNews.com) – Baby Joseph and his family arrived in Windsor, Ontario on a medical transport flight from St. Louis, Missouri this morning. He is now at the family home, according to Brother Paul O’Donnell.

On behalf of Baby Joseph’s family, Brother O’Donnell told LifeSiteNews that that their son was weaned off ventilator support 12 days ago and has been successfully breathing on his own since then.

Baby Joseph, who has been at the center of an international right-to-life debate over the past few months, has defied critics by responding so well to treatment. After the Ontario hospital treating Joseph’s progressive and terminal neurological disease threatened to remove his life support against his parents’ wishes earlier this year, pro-life groups rallied to Joseph’s cause.

With the financial support and assistance of Father Frank Pavone and Priests for Life, Joseph was taken to Cardinal Glennon Children’s Medical Center in St. Louis, Missouri where doctors performed the tracheotomy that Joseph’s parents had been requesting all along.

Sixteen-month-old Baby Joseph received a successful tracheotomy on March 21, responding well to the procedure, which gave him increased mobility and comfort while providing a stable, secure airway. With the tracheotomy, which created an opening into Joseph’s windpipe through an incision in his neck, Joseph’s airway has been kept free from secretions that would have caused him to choke.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011 13:38 
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Let me add that I am still smiling with a smile from ear to ear. I feel so much joy from this -why?

God Bless!!!!

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 21 Apr 2011 15:24 
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I saw some articles which stated that the tracheotomy should have been done when the respirator was first employed. It is much more comfortable than having that pipe down one's throat.

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 28 Sep 2011 10:32 
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The end of the story.Baby Joseph dies at home, surrounded by family
Quote:
... Alex Schadenberg of the Canada-based Euthanasia Prevention Coalition said Wednesday morning that Baby Joseph, who burst into international headlines earlier this year when Canadian doctors scheduled to remove him from life support against his family’s wishes, died at home 4:40 p.m. Tuesday, surrounded by his family.

“Joseph Maraachli lived a life that changed Canada,” said Schadenburg, whose intervention was pivotal in saving Joseph’s life. “My thoughts and prayers are with the Maraachli family.”

Baby Joseph’s father, Moe Maraachli, wrote on the official family Facebook page yesterday, “Joseph pass away very comfortable and peace fully like what i ask for him.”

“I would like to thank all who contributed to the support of Joseph,” he said. “I thank you very much.”....

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 Post subject: Re: Herod in Canada
PostPosted: 30 Sep 2011 04:10 
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JMJ

Prayers for the family. At least Baby Joseph died in the loving atmosphere of his family home, not kieed by so so-called medical 'expert'.

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