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And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16:18

I suddenly realised that for some reason I always thought this meant that Hell would never be able to attack and defeat the Church, imagining the gateposts used like battering rams by satan and his helpers. However, really gates are stationary.

So it should be the other way round and mean that Jesus and his followers are able to attack hell and be victorious. What do you think? Is the Church Militant supposed to be offensive or defensive? Do the gates of hell represent the sins of the world in earthly matters? Or is this verse not talking about the things of earth, but about the life to come?

I think it is Catholic teaching (maybe not?) that this verse means that Jesus promised the Church would always survive until the end of all things, but Jesus also wondered if he would find faith on earth when he returned.

Any thoughts are appreciated.

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Grace

As to the past, let us entrust it to God's mercy, the future to Divine Providence. Our task is to live holy the present moment. - Saint Gianna Molla

I am not sure but my interpretation is that Satan cannot stand against the Church

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Simon

Grace,

It is Christ's promise to us that the Catholic Church, and in particular the Pope, will never teach error.


http://www.youfixittube.com/watch?v=WWDEcWHbe5k

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James Daly

"It is the Lord." (Jn 21:7)

What?

Actually there is more to it than you may realize. "And on this rock" is the clue. A pagan religion popular at that time used to sacrifice first born babies on a rock next to the sea at the base of a cliff. Parents would drop the infant to land on this rock. Christianity is the new religion which is based on a loving and kind God who would never request such heinous sacrifices. "And on this rock" could indicate a new beginning from that rock, which satan could never return to.

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Pax et Bonum


Schultzz

Grace,

My Ignatius Catholic Study Bible goes into a lot of background and says that Jesus portrayed the church as a spiritual temple. Hell or Hades is,

Further down it describes Jewish tradition in regards a stone as the foundation of the Temple. From this background it states,

There is an imprimatur for the study bible so I think this description can be counted on to be accurate. However, there was a lot of background given for that passage that I didn't include because it was too extensive to type here.

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Valerie Garcia
vals1990@yahoo.com

"Listen, O my son, to the precepts of thy master, and incline the ear of thy heart, and cheerfully receive and faithfully execute the admonitions of thy loving Father, that by the toil of obedience thou mayest return to Him ....." St. Benedict

Grace,

What matters is how the Church understands this passage. In short, from the earliest times the Catholic Church has understood this passage to indicate:

i Christ extends His authority (auctoritas) to St Peter;
ii Christ promises that the Catholic Church will last until the end of time;
iii Christ promises that the Catholic Church, and in particular the Pope, will never teach error.

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James Daly

"It is the Lord." (Jn 21:7)

Good grief, people. We are trying to talk about Scripture and the Church here.

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Grace

As to the past, let us entrust it to God's mercy, the future to Divine Providence. Our task is to live holy the present moment. - Saint Gianna Molla

Good point, Grace. I've moved them to where that "discussion" can continue if they are still interested in doing so.

There is significance on the place that Jesus proclaimed Peter as the Rock and that the gates of Hell will not prevail against the Church. There is a nice read here:

Caesarea Philippi: The Significance to the Church and Petrine Authority

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Ian DC
Blessed Ever Virgin Mary -- Sanctuary and resting-place of the Blessed Trinity where God dwells in greater and more divine splendour than anywhere else in the universe

Interesting.
"As the mountain formed the nucleus of worship among the ancients, so too would the Church, symbolized by the mountain, do the same for Christians....
the mountain's imagery of stability and durability is theologically imposed on St. Peter, especially in light of Our Lord's subsequent words when He declares
…and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. (Matthew 16:18b)"

Again, it is about the forces of Hell not overcoming the Church, but I wonder if we aren't meant to understand that (that is a given, not up for debate), but also to go beyond that and see that the forces of Jesus will invade and overcome the dark powers, that the Church Militant is not supposed to be just defensively holding on to its bit of ground. I'm not sure that this turning it around matters, but if we read it literally, it doesn't say what we thought it says, and I've been thinking a lot lately about this because of the U.S. election.

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Grace

As to the past, let us entrust it to God's mercy, the future to Divine Providence. Our task is to live holy the present moment. - Saint Gianna Molla

Grace,

St. Paul does say our battle is with spirits of wickedness in the high places (Ephesians 6:12). So the Church's faithful are in constant warfare against demonic powers.

However, the Church is peaceful. It is the abode of God who is love, and of His Son Jesus and their Spirit. There is no aggression of the children of God to speak of, no invading and laying assault to the realms of darkness, because it is our nature as Christians to love, to serve, and thereby to invite, draw in, and include those needing shelter from the storm.

It is the nature of evil, on the other hand, to attack, to murder, to destroy, to plunder and confuse. It is the evil one who wishes to "sift us like wheat" (Luke 22:31), to invade our community of love and unity.

So this image of the gates of hell is actually kind of scary: they are not actually stationery posts sitting there which we invade and try to pull down as Christians. Rather, gates of hell are like the lid of Pandora's Box. The image is not so passive. Through this portal, or opening in the earth, so to speak, demonic legions flee from their dungeons and roam about the world looking to devour souls. The image in the ancient world of the portals of the enemy conjure up the exit from which armies pour out to menace and destroy.

Jesus is saying that demonic spirits leave hell. They fly out through its gates, so to speak. They are unleashed upon the world in savage fury and wrath through those evil portals (Revelation 12:12). But the Church is not afraid, for the Lord of Hosts will do battle for us, as David says in 1 Samuel 17:47.

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Sincerely in Christ,
Fr. Angel

Thank you very much, Father Sotelo. This makes sense to me.

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Grace

As to the past, let us entrust it to God's mercy, the future to Divine Providence. Our task is to live holy the present moment. - Saint Gianna Molla