Catholic Online Forum

So, what is wrong with sequestration (besides the stupid name) anyway?
Doesn't the government need to be cut back?
Couldn't we use a little European style austerity?

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

IMO, it is the manner in which the intended cutbacks will occur. Furloughing DOD Civilians, cutting back on Military Funding, mind you there is no mission cutback. I have heard nothing about cutting back elected officials pay, their traveling, including KOTUS who seems to spend an enormous amount of time on vacation.

I have seen no mention of cutbacks on Foreign Aid..etc.

_________________
Bob C

Bad as it is and as painful as it will be, it appears the only way even small budget cuts will happen under this worthless Congress and WH. I remember way back when California voters decided enough was enough with property taxes and voted a rollback, the state government made cuts in every area that would hurt the citizens in retaliation but dfidn't touch pet projects or perks. Those draconian measures set the stage for much of California's current problems and is what happens when equally immature voters and elected officials try to one-up each other. The US has progressively voted itself an absolutely dysfunctional government by voting on an emotional rather than a moral, ethical and rational basis.

_________________
BobA

Regarding Sequestration, If the sounds of freedom coming through my back window are any indication, a lot of training is being conducted before the money runs out.

_________________
Bob C

Isn't there enough fat (waste, fraud, etc.) in every federal department, which if eliminated would account for the budget cuts?

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

Every time I hear the phrase "Non-essential government employee" I go cross eyed. If that individual is non-essential why are they employed by the government?

_________________
Bob C

Bob,



Because somehow a case was made that the employee was needed, and those who do the hiring were convinced of the need, and the employee was hired. Once hired, an organization without a profit-motive and without a need to stay in budget to stay in existence (e.g. the federal government) has no incentive to let the employee go. There probably isn't even a process in place to periodically review what employees are doing and determine whether they can be redeployed or let go.

_________________
Dean
Most people's sense of history goes back to breakfast time - Benjamin Netanyahu

Perhaps for the same reasons I have some "non-essential" food on my table and furniture in my home. Even non-essentials may be desirable and useful.

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

David,



True, but my tax dollars do not pay for your non-essentials. My tax dollars do pay for non-essential government functions.


A recent example of Government waste and non-essential idiocy. I turned on the end of the Oscar presentation to see what won "Best Picture" and there was FLOTUS doing the announcing that's okay, I get that FLOTUS gets to do things that us mere citizens don't get to do. But what the heck were the dozen or so Military Aides in Full Mess Dress doing there? Nothing more then eye candy for the TV and for her to say look at me Mrs important. And FLOTUS is not authorized Military Aides!

_________________
Bob C

As I explained the last time, and you accepted the argument:



What if they were all at a formal party in the White House for the Oscars (or even some other occasion) which the aides would typically attend?

_________________
Jeff Stevens

It is an interesting question of what gets cut. From what I can tell, every department, agency, etc...is being told "Cut 1%", across the board. So the agency gets to decide what is cut. I seriously suspect that they are deliberately cutting high-profile services to advertise how important they are as well as put pressure on Congress to solve this mess. I can't blame them, but I don't agree with it either.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

Yes. But I think the "fraud, waste, and abuse" tends to happen in three areas:
1) The highest levels, where Congress mandates such waste. Examples include the "bridge to nowhere" and the Joint Strike Fighter. Seriously, extending, fighting for, or trying to get programs put in their district as a roundabout way of buying votes in the form of jobs for constituents.

That ain't going anywhere.

2) Panic spending before the end of the fiscal year so you use up all your budget so your budget doesn't get cut. Happens at EVERY level of government.

3) At the very lowest level, where people steal office supplies, slack on the job, aren't invested in doing their job well, etc. This is EXTREMELY hard to weed out, but leads to the most inefficiency, IMO.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

Jeff,



But essential is what they are called....and words mean things. BTW, I do accept your argument, but it still drives me nuts.




I hadn't thought of that possibility and that is probably a good guess, but they were still only on Camera to make her look important.

_________________
Bob C

That is certainly true.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

Jeff,




Yep, sure does.



That used to drive me nuts, I'd need a pen and every damned pen in the supply cabinet would be in some kids back pack. When I finally got to a rank I could do something about it, I put an end to it in my shop.

_________________
Bob C

Are you saying that the Military Aides were being paid overtime wages? Or that they would not be paid if they doing something else? What would the savings be if they were not doing this?

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

I was mystified by this issue, until I saw an interview about it- I forget the man's name but I recall he was identified as a writer for the website Red State.

At the time the deal was made including the sequester, most everyone wanted to reduce deficits but could not agree on how to do it. The idea was, these sequester cuts would be so undesirable and frightening that politicians would certainly find a better agreement of some sort rather than do the sequester. It was sort of like Mutually Assured Destruction in nuclear politics. The sequester had big defense cuts which traditional Republicans would loathe, and cuts to Democratic-loved programs would also be draconian. So, rather than face these cuts, some new deficit reduction plan would surely be found.

The gap in logic was pointed out by the Red State fellow. While it has been true for decades that traditional Republicans have held a muscular defense posture as almost sacred, this is not true really of the most recent 150 or so new Republican members of Congress. If they could be said to have one issue, the one issue is the deficit. So they don't mind the sequester much, and don't see it as an incentive to make some less onerous deficit-reducing laws. Not the party leaders, but many votes in the House.

So, the sequester turns out to be the most likely outcome.

As I see it, the sequester was not designed to be an actual budget to run needed programs. It was designed to scare politicians into moving toward a real budget. Because of this design, it's implementation in real life is likely to disrupt many things that ought not be disrupted.

_________________
Charles MacKenzie

"For nature is one with rapine, a harm no preacher can heal;
The Mayfly is torn by the swallow, the sparrow spear'd by the shrike,
And the whole little wood where I sit is a world of plunder and prey."
-Tennyson

Heh. Pretty sure that no one in the military gets paid more for working more...for working different work (combat pay), for working in different places (flight pay, hardship pay), but not for working MORE.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

A good analysis. I've heard similar, except the italicized, which does help us understand it.

It must be understood that the cuts are across the board on discretionary spending, it's just that Defense happens to be like 80% of discretionary spending.

(Please know what "discretionary spending" means before responding about how important defense spending is.)

_________________
Jeff Stevens

There is plenty of fat. In my opinion, a focus alone on eliminating fraud and waste is premised upon a believe that government is efficient or productive -it is not. Government is always an expense -a necessary evil which in my opinion now involves itself with far too much.

There is much dead wood in government -much stupidity. Many overpaid experts with advanced degrees riding desks and making power point presentations using big words and private sector catch phrases to sell what amounts to as useless regurgitated garbage as a supposed critical service or product that only government can supply. I speak from experience having worked with many -I have seen these leeches that suck on the government teat that all things being equal without government protecting them would be failures in the real world.

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

A real budget would be nice -it has only been several years since the US Senate let one be passed. Compromise always comes as a result of the budget process; HOWEVER, since the US Senate holds the budget process hostage there has been no compromise -yet, here we are with the indignant non compromising left claiming that the right will not compromise?

If memory serves correct, the Republicans have demanded a budget be passed before any more 'talks' of adjusting the as yet non existent budget the US has been operating under. since the left started holding the budget process hostage.

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

Michael Medved (a syndicated radio host) had a replay of several snippets of a "diversity expert" leading a session at the department of agriculture. What most disgusted me (besides the price tag of for approx. $200,00) was the sheep like behavior of the audience who where apparently supposed to say "bam" with great emphasis upon some important point or simply repeat back what the expensive genius was telling them. It was basically an assault on white men and whites in general and an utter waste of time and money and disgusting to listen to. I have heard that there is an state university diversity czar that has recently been hired in San Diego for over $200,000 salary so we could cut that sort of thing...and yes, I realize state universities aren't the Federal government but I can't believe that "bam" isn't being said across the board in the Federal government.

_________________
Valerie Garcia
vals1990@yahoo.com

"Listen, O my son, to the precepts of thy master, and incline the ear of thy heart, and cheerfully receive and faithfully execute the admonitions of thy loving Father, that by the toil of obedience thou mayest return to Him ....." St. Benedict

==> Michelle Obama On Oscars Criticism: 'Absolutely Not Surprising'

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

I just heard on the news some general was saying that the Army would have to stop training 80% of its troops. How can a 3% budget cut have such a drastic result?

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

Easy, you just take all the cut out of the most critical part of your budget and say "See what you made me do!"

_________________
- Joe Kelley

Death is only a shadow across the path to Heaven.

David,





http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-03-01/u ... ts/4549060

_________________
James Daly

"It is the Lord." (Jn 21:7)

_________________
James Daly

"It is the Lord." (Jn 21:7)

So that I am absolutely clear. My complaint here was not about Mrs Obama, I get that the first family gets to do things that other families don't get to do. My objection was to the Military Aides being used as a backdrop. She may be the First Lady, but she is not Mrs Commander-in Chief

_________________
Bob C

Perhaps, 3% of the Army's budget is involved in 80% of the training.

_________________
Bob C

Is training that critical? Depends on the training.

_________________
Bob C

The annual Air Fest at MacDill AFB, where they bring in static displays of all the Military's toys err tools and have several aerial demonstrations. Usual the Army's Demonstration Jump team does a Halo jump and either the Navy's Blue Angels or the Air Force Thunderbirds will fly.

This year was supposed to be the Blue Angels, it was announced tonight that the Air Fest has been cancelled, and that the Navy and Air Force have cancelled all demonstration shows for the remainder of the year. I have mixed feelings about this for the personnel who work and live on MacDill the weekend returns to a regular weekend, and the duty schedule will remain standard, as opposed to 95% of the people being on duty either smiling and answering questions from civilians, or directing traffic. And the people who live there can actually get on and off the base.

The Air shows are wonderful recruiting tools, spectacular to watch but they are man hour intensive and financially expensive to put on.

As a former recruiter I both enjoyed and dreaded the annual shows along Jones beach in NY ((I was a recruiter on long Island) we had to get all spiffed up, walk around smiling and handing out info to passer byes. Yet in the following weeks there would be a very nice uptick of people walking in the door.

_________________
Bob C

To add some perspective -quoting from what in my opinion is the leftist controlled Wikipedia:

2013 United States federal budget



Discretionary $1.510 trillion
Mandatory $2.293 trillion

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

Anybody feeling the effects of sequestration yet?

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

I thought I read that there had been no budget passed since Pres. Obama took office.

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

Traffic is a little lighter.

I shouldn't make light. This is hurting some people pretty bad. Some have lost their jobs over it. Nobody I know, but friends of friends.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

That is correct. In essence, President Obama spends now proportionately on items and priorities decided based upon a budget (continuing resolution adjusted for inflation and additional built in increases) passed by democrats a few years ago.

The House elected in 2010 to remove the garbage has yet to be granted the opportunity -the nation's spending priorities and amounts remain held hostage by the leftists.

For instance, as Kerry has just announced -we now send $250 million to Egypt that we do not have for an ally that no longer exists. We as well fund green energy black holes and any number of idiotic leftist initiatives STILL.

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

I have read a few articles on the subject as to how the impact will affect the DC area.

I imagine that stopping construction on the Tower of Babel impacted that local community quite hard. -of course, the outlying communities benefited by no longer sacrificing their resources for tower construction and all that it entailed.

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

Yeah, those border patrol officers and FBI counter-terrorism analysts are just like people trying to be like God.

Exactly.

_________________
Jeff Stevens

So, to call something the "2013 Federal Budget", is at the very least misleading.

_________________
David L (CA)
"Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read.” - Groucho Marx

You are correct. However, there are 'budgets' out there e.g. proposed budgets -the President still goes through the motions although he seems to be late with it recently. The House as well proposes budgets...

As far as the "2013 Federal Budget" -I would say that it is actually the continuing resolution of the "2009 Federal Budget" adjusted for inflation and built in increases etcetera.

In my opinion, the economic landscape, outlook and as such priorities of the people in 2009 were quite different than now. Many of the people in the House that passed that budget are no longer in office -so much for limited terms and taxation without representation.

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

That should actually be the continuing resolution of the "2010 Federal Budget" (passed in 2009) adjusted for inflation and built in increases etcetera.

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51

Jeff,





(From the link I provided above.)

_________________
James Daly

"It is the Lord." (Jn 21:7)

Actually, the real issue revolves around who better decides how to spend my money taken from me by government -I prefer it be me through my representative rather than as it is now preordained and decided by some leftist politician no longer in office.

As far as the 'security' concerns you refer to -I say shutting down the TSA would be step one...

_________________
Daniel

"Do you think that I have come to establish peace on the earth? No, I tell you, but rather division." -- Luke 12:51